PGHIMC - Pittsburgh Independent Media Center

Pittsburgh City Council special taser meeting
by concerned citizen Tuesday, Sep. 13, 2005 at 12:22 PM

Special City Council meeting to discuss the use of tasers by Pittsburgh Police. Wednesday - 1:30PM

Wednesday (9/14/05) at 1:30PM, the Pittsburgh City Council will be holding a post-agenda, public meeting to discuss the usage of tasers by Pittsburgh Police on non-violent demonstrators on A20.

510 City County Building
414 Grant Street
downtown Pittsburgh

public speaking not allowed
by david Wednesday, Sep. 14, 2005 at 1:08 AM

a city official explained to me that only invited speakers will be allowed to speak.

So how does one get invited?
by Janus Christ Wednesday, Sep. 14, 2005 at 3:36 AM

So how does someone get an invite to the meeting?

789
by 899 Wednesday, Sep. 14, 2005 at 11:25 AM

my guess is it works like the rest of our political system,
if you've got connections to those in power, you're in. otherwise you don't even know what's going on. now what do people want to bet the police managed to secure an invite to this special event.

i
by i Wednesday, Sep. 14, 2005 at 3:53 PM

Unless I'm losing my command of the english language this is a public meeting open to all, it's the SPEAKERS who are being selected by invitation only.

7897898
by 9898 Wednesday, Sep. 14, 2005 at 4:05 PM

right, it is "open" to the public, but how "public" is it if few know about it until right before it happens, they hold it at a time most people are working, and you have to get a special invite to speak (i.e no public comment). They told the media they would eventually be holding a public hearing on taser use. While this event may technically fit the bill, it seems a shaddy way to do it. If you really want to see the citizenry engaged and democracy in action- announce the times far in advance, hold one hearing during the day and one at night, and allow anyone (police, private citizens, group representives) to speak.

WWOOO HOOOO !!
by concerned citizen Thursday, Sep. 15, 2005 at 12:34 PM

The Police win. Of course, the Police were right again, and you kiddies were wrong.

Hey, some advice. When the cop (who has the taser, the gun and the baton) says to cooperate ..... just f-ing cooperate. You want to make your political statements and challenge the cop, then you will RIGHTLY get you skanky ass thumped. Cooperate. get arrested. Go to court and challenge him there. Follow the rules and the Constitution.

Oh, I forgot. The rules don't apply to you precise little brilliant poster children for abortion.

Sgt. Schultz or Chief McNeilly
by Hogan Thursday, Sep. 15, 2005 at 12:42 PM

0915taser-b.jpg, image/jpeg, 150x203

I know nuzzing. I see nuzzing. What the fuck does he know?

.
by Anti-Imperialist Saturday, Sep. 17, 2005 at 4:10 AM

The negative arguments, whether by rightwing idiots, naive teens, or government agents, should be ignored. It should be assumed that ALL comments of negativity, despair, divisiveness, and animosity are acts of "the enemy"...the government. Whether or not it is true, the most stategically effective way to deal with this nonsense is to assume the worst...that's it's being done by government agents assigned to destroy our movement. If by happenstance we should be wrong...perhaps it'll make the guilty party think twice before posting useless and counterproductive garbage. Hence, they MIGHT AS WELL be agents as well. It's clearly a VERY radical mindset to take, but a necessary one in pre-Revolutionary times.

fgjghj
by jkljk Saturday, Sep. 17, 2005 at 11:13 AM

I should have clarified in my post above that it is the "comments" section of indymedia that is pretty much useless and not taken seriously. Pgh indymedia and other sites have taken great steps to improve the quality of the site in general and I find it a valuable resource. The problem is the comments section by it's nature is harder to improve, options being let it go to shit or moderate the hell out of it. Neither of those are appealing options.

Why do I keep getting censored?
by Janus Christ Sunday, Sep. 18, 2005 at 3:37 AM

Why do my posts keep getting deleted? No one did anything about that "niggerhater" post that was on here and yet my much less offensive troll posts, few and far between as they are, get deleted.

Also to repeat, no one give a shit about "anarchy", quit wasting your time preaching to the choir.

---
by --- Sunday, Sep. 18, 2005 at 4:17 PM

"Oh yeah because if there's one thing wrong with Indymedia it's the extreme right wing bias. </sarcasm>"

No, there's many things wrong with Indymedia, but it is true that dileberate disruption of the comments section has pretty much destroyed it as a venue for real dialogue. Who the hell wants to discuss things on a forum where most comments are either racial slurs, random one liners, and right-wing troll bait about lice ridenn commiee hippies destroying the countries moral values?

"Possibly, but I highly doubt there's just as many "old" anarchists as there are young ones."

And you're basing this on what? How much do you know about the anarchist movement worldwide? How many anarchists do you think there are in the US? In Spain? In Canada? You know (or think you know) a little bit about the people who utilize one particular tactic, then you try and extrapolate who you think they are to be the entire sum of people who hold particular viewpoints. The vast majority of anarchists in Pittsburgh that I know don't even participate in Black Blocs.

"If you're refering to the Black Bloc that's a pretty accurate statement. While I'm a bit confused as to who started what on August 20th, the last two times Bush was in town to be protested I saw these idiots push a barricade over and play "duck duck goose" in the middle of Penn Avenue. Maybe "getting into fights" is inaccurate, the terms "causing trouble" and "acting stupid" are probably more fitting terms."

So it's a fairly accurate statement, only wait "maybe getting into fights is inaccurate" HUH? You'd think you'd go for consistancy at least throughout the entirety of one paragraph. Obviously you feel disruption and confrontational tactics are not productive so I won't bother to address that as you don't seem able of having a real discussion on such topics.

"If I ever catch someone doing that, I'm going to curb them American History X style."

Great, threats of violence. Wow. You've really disintguished yourself from the people who post random one liners on a messageboard or topple police barricades at Bush protests. How about this, we all agree right now that you have a big dick and you can avoid having to trying to prove it in the future? Fair deal?

Diruption of the comments
by OH WATAGERKAYAM Sunday, Sep. 18, 2005 at 7:36 PM

"The disruption of hte comments section" has made it useless ! Oh that is rich. You leftists are all a tither because someone dare disagree with you. Of course, since they disagree with you they must be racists. Oh, what a flipping hoot.

You leftists have all run away screaming from what could be a very meaningful forum for dialogue. And I mean dialogue, not just spewing the same old lefty anarchist, Big Rainbow flag, VoteForKerryHateBush crap.

You all have created a very exclusive club for yourselves. If anyone dare disagree with you they are immediately suspect, must be part of the vast rightwing consiracy, are part of the problem, must be driven from society, can not be spoken to, drive SUVs to destroy the environment, keep their women barefoot and in the kitchen, donate generously to the KKK, love NASCAR, hate freedom, and vote Republican. Sounds like you all are the racists and prejudice hate mongers to me.

Seriously, it has been said here before by more than one writer, that you all are mising your greatest opportunity to contribute to the common good and grow in stature and wisdom. Some of the most meaningful, intospective and sharp witted comments here have come from the "freepers". Yet you turn your back on them. Why? Oh of course there are those assholes who have to post the niggerbashing racist bs, but there are also those imbeciles here who post equally ignorant crap about Republicans, whites, Jews, and others that are currently out of favor with the left.

The opportunity is being given to you to make IMC something meaningful and not just another high school prom committee for the left. Think of it this way, your logic and arguments have not held up against the wave of sensible opposition and better wit. Maybe that is way you are admitting that IMC has failed. Maybe;)

Inflation of the ego and its relation to negative sexual experiances
by Janus Christ Sunday, Sep. 18, 2005 at 8:11 PM

WAH, if that was something of a post in my defense I appreciate it.

"No, there's many things wrong with Indymedia, but it is true that dileberate disruption of the comments section has pretty much destroyed it as a venue for real dialogue."

Yeah, so why doesn't the great and benevolent shadow government of Indymedia just delete those comments? They certainly have no qualms about removing mine. Or run the comments section as a BBS with accounts and all that? You'd have alot fewer trolls if it meant that trolls had to actually take time to start an account.

And as WAH said, does that statement somehow mean that you think that Indymedia is a failure?

"The vast majority of anarchists in Pittsburgh that I know don't even participate in Black Blocs."

You must not know very many then. The last Bush protest I was at (duck duck goose incident) I counted at least 20 in the BB, none of them could have been older than their late 20s. Anarchism, communism, punkism, its all bullshitism to me.

If I ever see someone defacing a veterans memorial like that, I'm going to bash their faces against the curb. My stance won't change on that. My uncle didn't die in Nam so that people could figuratively piss on his grave.

ger
by gg Monday, Sep. 19, 2005 at 10:21 AM

”Yeah, so why doesn't the great and benevolent shadow government of Indymedia just delete those comments?”

They do delete a lot of the garbage.

”And as WAH said, does that statement somehow mean that you think that Indymedia is a failure?”

If you bothered to read above, I think Indymedia is great. Pittsburgh’s in particular is a good place to find out about upcoming events, read some cool stories, and hear an awesome radio show. It’s only the comments section that is fairly useless for anything beyond getting updates on things. It used to be that there would be real debates on imc with people from many perspectives, which rarely happens now. Part of the reason is definitely the disruption from right-wingers. I’m talking about trolls exclusively, not the I have a different opinion and want to discuss it type.

I think imc’s are doing a better job of hiding troll posts but it’s hard to get people to come back to participate in something they gave up on. Also an issue of getting a critical mass, the less substantive posters there are the more it appears it’s nothing but trolls and crazies, but in order to get people who want to discuss they have to think there’s a point. Chicken and the egg.

”You must not know very many then. The last Bush protest I was at (duck duck goose incident) I counted at least 20 in the BB, none of them could have been older than their late 20s. Anarchism, communism, punkism, its all bullshitism to me.”

No, the point is there are apparently a lot more anarchists than you believe. You judge a value/belief system off of who you think participates in a particular tactic, which makes little sense. There are probably about 90 anarchists I know in this city who don’t participate in black blocs, many of them don’t even go to protests. Within black blocs there are a lot of people who don’t identify as anarchists. That’s what happens when it’s a tactic and not an organization.

”If I ever see someone defacing a veterans memorial like that, I'm going to bash their faces against the curb. My stance won't change on that. My uncle didn't die in Nam so that people could figuratively piss on his grave.”

What a meaningful way to encourage dialogue; just repeat stupid threats on the Internet! Lets keep the testosterone rolling! You’re half-way towards “trouncing mountains of ass”

Hiding a large number of these comments
by Daniel P Wednesday, Sep. 21, 2005 at 2:38 AM
dannyp@indypgh.org

I've hidden a large number of comments on this post, pursuant to our Editoral Policy, Most were hidden for being off-topic. Comments that do not directly relate to the article in question are subject for hiding. I hid posts on a wide range of topics, including personal conflicts, general penis-waving, statements for and against the Vietnam war and Vietnam veterans, so on and so forth. None of these further the discussion of the city council meeting.

I also hid some posts for being either racist or sexist. I considering using terms in a manner that is derogatory to women as sexist. The usage of the derivative of the word nigger in a clearly offensive fashion was considered racist.

I did not remove some off-topic comments that were directly related to the administration of this site with specific regards to the treatment of comments on this page. Comments that were vague and not directed in their support or criticism of the IMC were hidden, but comments that were specifically asking, supporting, or criticizing the enforcement of the editorial policy on this and similar pages were allowed. The comments aren't the correct place to voice these concerns, so in the future people should direct concerns related to editorial policy to imc-pgh-editorial@lists.indypgh.org.

If you'd like to see the comments that I've hidden, you are able to by following the view hidden posts link on the main page and checking off comments. Complaints, support, thoughts, or ideas regarding comments as well as the editorial policy's content, interpretation, and enforcement can be directed to imc-pgh-editorial@lists.indypgh.org.

It is a growing opinion among folks who are involved with the editorial collective that comments are becoming less and less valuable in furthering our mission to serve the local community with a system for disseminating print and online news. This site is not intended as a community discussion board. There are other places, such as craigslist and usenet, that are more suited for that. If you have strong opinions as to the value of keeping comments on this site in furthering the IMC's goals, please email the editorial collective.

Thank you,

Daniel P.
Pittsburgh IMC volunteer

Fair enough
by Janus Christ Wednesday, Sep. 21, 2005 at 3:41 AM

..........

UNFAIR MORE THAN ENOUGH
by OH WATAGERKAYAM Wednesday, Sep. 21, 2005 at 6:32 AM

"It is a growing opinion among folks who are involved with the editorial collective that comments are becoming less and less valuable in furthering our mission to serve the local community with a system for disseminating print and online news. This site is not intended as a community discussion board. There are other places, such as craigslist and usenet, that are more suited for that. If you have strong opinions as to the value of keeping comments on this site in furthering the IMC's goals, please email the editorial collective. "
____________

Danny P:

So just how do you have DISCUSSION and keep it ENTIRELY to the original topic post. That sounds like some kind of fascist speech police thing.

The nature of DISCUSSION is that people necessarily express their opinions. Sure you want to disseminate news, but the biggest value of IMC is the opportunity of free and open DISCUSSION. Do away with that and you are missing an incredible opportunity to actually contribute to the vast reservoir of human knowledge and understanding.

The PGH IMC has had issues in the past with its editing policies, in many cases it has appearred to be clear censoring. And Censorship is never good. IMC's everywhere pursue a practice of censorship. But PGH is no where near the worst f these. Go to SFIMC or NYCIMC. It is practically a Nazi regime at those.

You guys are all toooooooooo worked up about the trolls. Sure there are a few and infrequent posters, probably drunk judging from the times of the posts, that will get in and just type racial slurs, but the are also CLEARLY not rerpesentive of the vast majority of those posters to whom you would apply your prejudice of "troll".

I am absolutely shocked that you are so willing to throw int he towel to the "trolls". Those trolls must really be a threat to the sanctity of the regal and sublime IMC to warrant the abridgement of the rights of all citizens in the agora of IMC.